Are some genre's not supported?

SanDisk MP3 players Sansa® Fuze™
1

Hi All,

Wow, It’s incredible that this MP3 player only supports ID3 tag browsing, and doesn’t properly support id3 tags! At first, I found that it doesn’t support id3v2.4, which has apprently been around for 8 YEARS, only id3v2.3! I’m unhappy about having to convert my tags, it’s an extra step, which I’m not looking forward to doing when I convert all of my 300+ CDs. In my opinion, it’s unacceptable that the sandisk doesn’t support id3 tags properly. It can’t be hard, all of my music software does fine, and my samsung mp3 player works perfectly. This is something that can be fixed with a firmware update. 

Despite my unhappyness, there’s not a lot I can do now, so I converted a few albums to id3v2.3 (ISO character encoding) to see how it works. The albums in question were tagged as “Indie” genre, but still come up as “Unknown” genre on the fuze!  Has anyone else had this problem? Would anyone out there be able to do an independet check on this issue, and re-tag something to “Indie” and see if the fuze recognises it?

Cheers.

2

It should recognize any genre you use, provided the tag is in the correct format. Try using mp3tag to edit your tags.

3

@rlongland wrote:

At first, I found that it doesn’t support id3v2.4, which has apprently been around for 8 YEARS, only id3v2.3! This is something that can be fixed with a firmware update. 

ID3v2.4 support is indeed on the table and is said to be coming out in a future f/w update. I don’t remember if it’s supposed to be the next one or not. If so, it’s due out any day now! :smiley:

4

@rlongland wrote:

The albums in question were tagged as “Indie” genre, but still come up as “Unknown” genre on the fuze!  Has anyone else had this problem? Would anyone out there be able to do an independet check on this issue, and re-tag something to “Indie” and see if the fuze recognises it?

I re-named the Genre to ‘Indie’ on an album in MP3Tag. The Fuze recognized it and played it with no problems. No ‘Unknown’ entries. So you must have another issue with the tags in question. Maybe it’s still tagged with the 2.4 version that isn’t supported yet? Sometimes it’s easy to chnage, but forget to SAVE? :wink:

5

@rlongland wrote:

The albums in question were tagged as “Indie” genre, but still come up as “Unknown” genre on the fuze!  Has anyone else had this problem? Would anyone out there be able to do an independet check on this issue, and re-tag something to “Indie” and see if the fuze recognises it?

I re-named the Genre to ‘Indie’ on an album in MP3Tag. The Fuze recognized it and played it with no problems. No ‘Unknown’ entries. So you must have another issue with the tags in question. Maybe it’s still tagged with the 2.4 version that isn’t supported yet? Maybe you changed it, but forgot to SAVE?  :wink:

MP3Tag makes quick work of changing tags ‘en masse’, so it shouldn’t be a huge deal to convert all of your albums to the different format. It can be done in only a a few mouse-clicks.

Or, you could just wait until the v2.4 is supported in the firmware update.

6

I use ID3 tags and with no problem. I even put my own custom names in the Genre section and it displays it with no problem (i.e.- Hiphop changed to “HipHop Anonymous” and Alternative Rock is changed to “The Alternative Life”).

7

Thanks, guys. I hope the new firmware fixes this, but it looks like there is something wrong with how I changed the tag. I’m pretty sure I did hit save, although it’s always a possibility :wink: At least I know that it has nothing to do with it only allowing some genres.

Unfortunately, I can’t use the windows programs (MP3tag) suggested, but there are a few linux apps that should do the trick. Maybe the one I tried was no good… I’ll report back if I find a solution. 

Thanks again,

Rich 

8

Running MP3tag with linux can be done, check this thread in the MP3Tag forum.  It’s nice that they have a forum as well.

As well as it works, don’t forget to support the authors if you can!!

Bob  :smileyvery-happy:

9

neutron_bob, dude, you rock. Thanks, that really helps with some of the tag problems that I’ve been having.

10

Woah there! I don’t consider this solved! For starters, I don’t like to run windows programs through wine, and many other linux users don’t either. I was going to find a native solution to this problem, and then mark it as solved so people in my boat will know what to do! Can I un-solve this?

Cheers,

Rich

11

@rlongland wrote:

Woah there! I don’t consider this solved! For starters, I don’t like to run windows programs through wine, and many other linux users don’t either. I was going to find a native solution to this problem, and then mark it as solved so people in my boat will know what to do! Can I un-solve this?

You (and only you) should have that option if you click on the Options button in the upper right-hand corner. :smiley:

There are other tagging programs beside MP3Tag. Some work with Linux. I think there’s one called Easy-Tagger (I may have the name slightly off) that works with Linux?

12

Yeah, there’s tons of different tagging programs that you can use you don’t want to use WINE.

13

A quick Googling shows this from Linux.com, with about 30 seconds’ effort…   There are lots of applications available for the linux platform, no WINE needed.

Cheese, on the other hand, might come in handy.

Bob  :wink:

14

@tapeworm wrote:

There are other tagging programs beside MP3Tag. Some work with Linux. I think there’s one called Easy-Tagger (I may have the name slightly off) that works with Linux?

EasyTAG

I use the version from the Ubuntu repositories. Works very well.

A couple of things to  be careful of:

  • It is capable of handling tags on all files in a directory tree. This is on by default, which can be annoying.You can turn it off.

  • Also, if the tags in the current directory (tree) don’t conform to the format you have set up in the options, it will offer to save them all in that format when you attempt to navigate away from the directory.
    These can be frustrating at first. But they are very useful when you want to make sure all your tags are the same format and use the same character set - E.G. SanDisk’s favourite ID3v2.3/ISO8859.

15

First off, I did mention that there are a few linux apps that I knew of that I would try. I had actually already played around with easytag, which is probably my editor of choice. It didn’t help me, though. So I also tried eyeD3 and KID3. I was annoyed that the thread had been marked as “solved”, when I didn’t consider it to be (I’m pretty sure I didn’t mark it). I wasn’t asking for an editor to use, although I do appreciate the helpful comments, especially from daytona955.

Right, on to business. I did some playing around last night, and this is where I’m at:

Re-tagging files didn’t work. I used all of the linux programs that tag in id3v2.3 that I could find. That’s eyeD3, KID3 and EasyTag. I was only working with “Indie” genres, and all of them gave the same result of “Unknown” genre (artist and album are fine). Although at one point, I got “Unknowndie”!!

Here’s the interesting part. If I use a custom genre tag, such as “Indie Rock”, which isn’t on the genre list provided by the programs, it works! So, although the issue isn’t fixed, I can work around it.

This looks like it’s coming from some incompatibility between the fuze and the Linux id3 libraries. All of the pre-defined genres are associated with a code number, so, for example, if I tag something with “Indie”, and look at the tag, eyeD3 says something like:
genre = “Indie (id#131)”
If I tag it as “Indie Rock” it gives me:
genre = “Indie Rock”
This only seems to happen for some genres. Blues and Rock work fine, but Sountrack doesn’t either. This must be some difference between linux and windows implementations of id3v2.3, which is a little worrying. I’ll have to head off to the linux forums to follow up on this.

In the mean time, I can get around the issue by using non-standard genres, even “Soundtrack.” (with a period) might do it. Maybe this will all be irrelevent when they update the firmware :slight_smile:

Thank you all for the help. I’ll get back to you if I find anything worth mentioning.

16

Having said EasyTAG works well for me, I should have added that I don’t make much use of genres. And now I look at my Fuze I see I have quite a few Unknown genres. Sorry :frowning:

I’ll check this out some more when I get home & have a look at my library (which is hosted on Linux, but also visible via SMB on our Windows boxes).

I gave up on genres because my e260v2 was so cr&ppy at handling them…

17

OK - there seems to be a problem with the Fuze firmware.

If tracks tagged ‘Indie’ are transfered via MTP to the Fuze’s internal memory, all is well - the tag shows up correctly.

In any other case - i.e. transfer via MTP to External Memory (aka uSD), or transfer via MSC to Internal Memory or External Memory - the tag shows up as ‘unknown’.

Further, when connected to a Windows host via MTP, the Windows Explorer properties sheet for one of these tracks shows the genre as ‘unkown’, but if connected via MSC, the same track shows up as ‘Indie’ in the proerties sheet. Note that if the track is on the uSD, it can be seen in Windows Explorer when connected either by MTP or MSC.

Other tags that maybe affected by this are:  Folk, Progressive Rock, Christian Rock, Folk/Rock, Bluegrass

Message Edited by daytona955 on 12-02-2008 09:20 AM

18

Wow, thanks for doing such an extensive study on that! I’m glad that I’m not going mad!

I had completely forgotten that I’m using MSC (is that the same as UMS?) mode, as MTP doesn’t seem to be properly supported under linux yet. So even under windows with MSC, the genres get messed up?

Is this something to contact sandisk about? Or is the message here enough to catch their attention?

Thanks again for helping me look into this… I’m surprised it hasn’t surfaced until now. 

19

@daytona955 wrote:

OK - there seems to be a problem with the Fuze firmware.

 

If tracks tagged ‘Indie’ are transfered via MTP to the Fuze’s internal memory, all is well - the tag shows up correctly.

 

In any other case - i.e. transfer via MTP to External Memory (aka uSD), or transfer via MSC to Internal Memory or External Memory - the tag shows up as ‘unknown’.

I just tried all these different configurations on my Fuze and external card and I still get ‘Indie’ tagged properly; NO ‘Unknowns’. Tag changed while on the Fuze and/or card. Tag changed on computer, then transfered to both Fuze and card in both MTP & MSC mode. No problems. Still tagged ‘Indie’.

Maybe it’s an issue with the tagging program in use? I’m using Mp3Tag.

20

Hmm… interesting.

I was loading stuff under Windows that had been tagged with EasyTAG.

I have now tried the same tracks tagged using Mp3tag, and you are correct, the Fuze understands the Indie genre.

I don’t think that lets Sandisk off the hook though, because the Indie genre in the EasyTAG version is:

  • recognised by the Fuze when transferred via MTP
  • recognised by Windows Explorer
  • recognised by Mp3Tag
  • recognised by WMP
  • recogised by my daughter’s aged Samsung YP-Z5

So it is NOT a problem with the tag, it is a failure of the Fuze to understand a particular tag implementation.

I think Sandisk have some work to do on the stability of the tagging on the Fuze. Having said that, it seems a lot more solid than the e260v2…

I think it is likely that most taggers for Linux will suffer similar problems with Sandisk products, since they mostly depend on the same libraries (libid3tag & libid3) as EasyTAG.