Whats the best format besides FLAC to put music on Sansa Fuze?

Im sure there are alot of programs out there, but since Im new to the Sansa and want the best possible sound out of it, (i know FLAC files are considered one of the best but it takes up alot of space)

What would be the next best method to rip music from a CD and then drag and drop it into the Sansa without alot of complications to set up, or with a good tutorial for the newbies like me to use, but like and appreciate misic that hasnt been compressed alot?

Thank you

Brian

@fixit5561 wrote:

Im sure there are alot of programs out there, but since Im new to the Sansa and want the best possible sound out of it, (i know FLAC files are considered one of the best but it takes up alot of space)

 

What would be the next best method to rip music from a CD and then drag and drop it into the Sansa without alot of complications to set up, or with a good tutorial for the newbies like me to use, but like and appreciate misic that hasnt been compressed alot?

 

Thank you

Brian

www.google.com

There are plenty of possibilities for you, starting from simply ripping your CDs at a high bitrate using Windows Media Player, if quality is your primary concern- running 192 KB/s and up in either wma or mp3.

You can use an application like Media Monkey, Winamp, or others, which will both rip and manage the device.  With any such program, you can manually navigate to the music folder and drag-and-drop if preferred.

There’s Vorbis.org (or even MM) for an ogg encoder.

For FLAC, the FLAC homepage is directly linked for download via Wikipedia and Google.

As suggested above (rather briefly) try searching for mp3 / wma / ogg vorbis encoders or ripping engines in Google.  The choices will amaze you.

µsansa

FLAC takes up so much space that is why I had asked what the norm is out there. It’s great to have you guys to help us newbies along I dont know what Id do without ya’s!! Thanks a bunch.

I guess what I was asking is what does most people use to rip and put onto the Sansa so that it saves space but is great quality.

Thanks

@fixit5561 wrote:

FLAC takes up so much space that is why I had asked what the norm is out there. It’s great to have you guys to help us newbies along I dont know what Id do without ya’s!! Thanks a bunch.

 

I guess what I was asking is what does most people use to rip and put onto the Sansa so that it saves space but is great quality.

 

Thanks

 

I use ogg. And with the right set up was able to save some space and actually (IMO) got a better sound quailty. I would say that depending on your experiance with players and with Digital audio mp3 is probably easiest. 

@conversionbox wrote:


@fixit5561 wrote:

FLAC takes up so much space that is why I had asked what the norm is out there. It’s great to have you guys to help us newbies along I dont know what Id do without ya’s!! Thanks a bunch.

 

I guess what I was asking is what does most people use to rip and put onto the Sansa so that it saves space but is great quality.

 

Thanks

 


I use ogg. And with the right set up was able to save some space and actually (IMO) got a better sound quailty. I would say that depending on your experiance with players and with Digital audio mp3 is probably easiest. 

If you do go with MP3 then 192 kbps is a good compromise between sound and size.

I like mp3 at 192KB/s too.  It sounds fine, and isn’t a memory hog.  With complex classical pieces, a higher bit rate is nice, but 192 is great.  I use these files both on the Fuze and e280v2, so I’ve only ripped a few albums in Vorbis.

Bob  :smileyvery-happy:

@fuze_owner_gb wrote:


@fixit5561 wrote:

Im sure there are alot of programs out there, but since Im new to the Sansa and want the best possible sound out of it, (i know FLAC files are considered one of the best but it takes up alot of space)

 

What would be the next best method to rip music from a CD and then drag and drop it into the Sansa without alot of complications to set up, or with a good tutorial for the newbies like me to use, but like and appreciate misic that hasnt been compressed alot?

 

Thank you

Brian


www.google.com

Sorry, I didn’t mean to be flip with a response to your question; but if you ask 10 different people what codec and bit rate is “good sounding” to them, you will probably get 10 different responses.  That is because everyones ears are different and hear things differently.  What is “good” or “acceptable” to me, might not be for you.  I personally consider the MP3 format the “bottom feeder” of all audio codecs and would never consider it for regular use on my player.  They would have to take me away to a padded cell if I were “forced” to listen to 192 kbps encoded MP3’s for any length of time… but that’s me.  Your ears will tell you what will be the best codec and resolution for you.

I’m a firm believer that you cannot by-pass this important step for the best possible relationship with your new player; experimentation with various codecs and resolutions…

I agree with that!  It’s a matter of compromises and needs.  For me, it’s a definite treat to listan to FLAC or high quality OGG on the Fuze, having a “timeout” with the Grados and a perfect coffee.

Well, if I hadn’t left my meerschaums in Texas, it would be a little more perfect, come to think of it.

I make the trade for convenience, having music for the e200 as well (CDs and LPs are going to be high quality copies, after all, I have a Virtuoso VdH on the turntable!).

The Fuze has the capability, why not enjoy what it’s capable of?  Try experimenting with the various codecs and formats.

Bob  :smileyvery-happy:

Ogg Vorbis really does a good job of making a reasonably-small file that sounds excellent. Use at least quality level 4 or 5, that will put you around 160 or 192kbps. Few players (other than PC software) support Ogg, so I usually end up putting the Ogg version on my Fuze and then just deleting it. MP3 is still the king of compatibility.

At higher bitrates (particularly above 192kbps), the codecs don’t have to compress so much so they begin to all sounds fairly similar (i.e. good). Most of the stores that have recently begun selling MP3s encode them at 256kbps. If quality is really the desire, that’s a good bitrate.

Variable bitrate is also a way to improve the quality/size ratio. I usually use VBR MP3 with the --alt-standard preset, which averages around 192kbps but can go much higher.

To my ears, no compressed audio file sounds “good”.  Probably the best description I could give to compressed audio files and what I ask myself during the ripping/encoding process:  “What encoder, file format and bit rate sounds the least objectionable?”

If you want to take a few minutes for an interesting read, I would recommend looking at the following article.  It is a good overview of the decline of High Fidelity, mainly brought on by the introduction of the MP3:

Death of High Fidelity

If you’re going to go to the trouble to rip a bunch of CDs, do it right the first time and rip to FLAC.  Then you can transcode to as many different lossy formats as you want for portable use without ever having to rerip your CDs.  Plus you’ll be able to recreate your original CD is one is ever lost or damaged.

Problem is that many modern CDs are just plain recorded lousy.  Ripping and Encoding to FLAC or WAV isn’t going to solve that problem.  I’m finding that almost every current CD is over-saturated and has limited dynamic range .

Almost always, I have to correct these problems with my forensic audio restoration software in order to breathe any life into them.  THEN…After that step…yeah, I agree; save to the loss-less format of your choice.  Then you can put on the (uggghh) lossy codec of your choosing on your music player…:wink:

Ogg is the best sounding lossy codec, IMO.  I use mainly APE (very similar to FLAC) for lossless on my home setup, and convert to OGG for my handheld.  Unless you have some real dynamite headphones, I don’t think 99 out of 100 people could differentiate between a good OGG rip and FLAC on a handhelp with headphones, so for mobile purposes, it’s worth the sacrifice to save the space.

That’s one feature I like in JRMC…I keep my entire library encoded in lossless…but when I plug in my fuze, it’ll synchronize playlists of my choice automatically, and it’ll convert them to my codec of choice on the fly as it’s doing it.  So I keep large, high qual files on my 8 TB raid server at home, and can easily and quickly load any other format on the fly on my fuze without having to waste drive space on lower quality formats on my handheld.  I’m sure there’s other media progs that do that too, but JRMC was one of, if not the first, so I got locked into them quite awhile ago so I quit researching others too much.

Agreed on many modern CDs being recorded lousy.  Don’t know if I could go back and do any forensic work on them all though…70,000 files would be a bit too much work, IMO.  That’s also why I’m hesitant to mess with any other player with syncing my fuse…rebuilding that library would be daunting.  I keep backups of the backups in different places because I don’t want to have to redo all of that.

I will throw my thoughts in the ring I guess… I like OGG. It is what I use. I dont recomend it. Why? Because mp3 is easier to deal with if you are a novice user. If you have some chopps at this stuff then go with OGG. Most novice users wont hear a difference between the two.

Since Microsoft makes money off saying WMA is better than MP3, you can bet they don’t put any resource into making their MP3 encoder (on WMP) work especially well.  Two of the best rated are Lame and Helix.  Lame is free, Helix is owned by Realaudio… don’t know if you can get that with any of their free products.

Of the formats on Fuze, I tend to use ogg/vorbis most, but lame is close.  Another consideration is that (according so some sansa guy on this forum) mp3 gives longer battery life.

Someone posted that 192kb/s mp3 is a good compromise between quality and size.  A lot of folks would say that 64kb/s is too.  It depends on how much (and if) you notice the difference, how much space you have, and how much music you want loaded at once.  You may make different decisions for different albums.  Audiobooks I put on my e200 at 10kb/s.   Anyway if you keep FLAC files on your computer, or a detachable hard drive, you can generate a different bit rate or format pretty easily if you change your mind.

I think some of you are really going over the top here with your recommendations.  

I sincerely beleive that the average person really won’t hear or care about the difference in sound quality between an MP3 file (even recorded at a 128kbit/s) compared to a FLAC file.

Honestly, to fixit5561, if you rip your songs in MP3 format you’ll be more than happy with it.  I’d recommend going with 192kbit/s or variable bitrate as a minimum.  ogg format is also good.  Besides that I wouldn’t worry about it.

Unless you really are into your music and want the best sound quality you don’t need to worry that much about it.  People here seem to forget that the average person listens to his music on some cheap headphones.  

@corilof wrote:

I think some of you are really going over the top here with your recommendations.  

I sincerely beleive that the average person really won’t hear or care about the difference in sound quality between an MP3 file (even recorded at a 128kbit/s) compared to a FLAC file.

 

Honestly, to fixit5561, if you rip your songs in MP3 format you’ll be more than happy with it.  I’d recommend going with 192kbit/s or variable bitrate as a minimum.  ogg format is also good.  Besides that I wouldn’t worry about it.

 

Unless you really are into your music and want the best sound quality you don’t need to worry that much about it.  People here seem to forget that the average person listens to his music on some cheap headphones.  

We dont forget, but we offer solutions to the Question that was asked which was: “What is the best format besides Flac to put music on the Sansa Fuze?”

The best is different based on your needs.  We are giving suggestions which the OP can sort thru and make a decission from or they can do their own thing.

@conversionbox wrote:


@corilof wrote:

I think some of you are really going over the top here with your recommendations.  

I sincerely beleive that the average person really won’t hear or care about the difference in sound quality between an MP3 file (even recorded at a 128kbit/s) compared to a FLAC file.

 

Honestly, to fixit5561, if you rip your songs in MP3 format you’ll be more than happy with it.  I’d recommend going with 192kbit/s or variable bitrate as a minimum.  ogg format is also good.  Besides that I wouldn’t worry about it.

 

Unless you really are into your music and want the best sound quality you don’t need to worry that much about it.  People here seem to forget that the average person listens to his music on some cheap headphones.  


We dont forget, but we offer solutions to the Question that was asked which was: “What is the best format besides Flac to put music on the Sansa Fuze?”

The best is different based on your needs.  We are giving suggestions which the OP can sort thru and make a decission from or they can do their own thing.

Exactly, CB…

For me mp3 is totally unacceptable, as I only deal with original source material to begin with…  And I can hear the difference between mp3 any other format, with one ear tied behind my back…:stuck_out_tongue:

BUT, that’s me.  I’m not telling the OP that they can’t use mp3, but to test different codecs…and only they can make the determination what codec will work best for them.

@fuze_owner_gb wrote:

 

If you want to take a few minutes for an interesting read, I would recommend looking at the following article.  It is a good overview of the decline of High Fidelity, mainly brought on by the introduction of the MP3:

 

Death of High Fidelity

 Nothing to do with mp3’s.  It was happening way before that.  It is/was to get attention, spinning the dial on that AM radio until you hear some music, and you will hear the loudest music first and that station gets the ratings.

Now, the assumtion is that if you are home (like maybe in a good listening environment) you are more likely watching a video than listening to albums.  Music is for cars or background while you’re surfing the net with a computer fan hissing nearby.  Anything quieter than the road noise or computer fan doesn’t get heard, so they compress the dynamic range.  Doesn’t help to have producers whose ears were long since blasted out at rock concerts.

 But if you look around you can still get “old school” recordings with a large dynamic range.  “Best of Kodo” has a track with about a minute of music below -70dB, then crescendos up to full scale.  It all comes through fine on a compressed file, but not near a computer fan or in the car.  You might even need to turn of that fridge in the other room.

Message Edited by donp on 03-10-2009 03:41 PM