AA battery powered mp3 player?

Respectfully discussing:

  • much higher capacity. The Li-ion battery in my Fuze lasts 15-20 hours on a single charge, whereas one 2300mAh AA battery in my old i-River lasts over 40 hours, which is more than double the capacity. This was on you old i-river. How can you know what the charge/play time would be on the Sansa?

  • newer electronics is produced in smaller fabrication processes and uses less electricity/is more energy efficient. Relying on this logic and the fact that the task is the same - mp3 decoding (again I’m not interested in video) I gather it should last even longer.

***

  • What are widely available are the Duracell & Energizer alkalines. You can buy them just about anywhere; grocery stores, 7-11’s, & virtually any place battery-powered ‘toys’ are sold. Not always so with re-chargeables.

-  Almost all the people I know who use battery powered devices use NiMH rechargeables (with the exception of devices that specifically state that you shouldn’t use such batteries with them, namely blood pressure measuring devices)

  • Granted, rechargeables are not as widely available as non-rechargeables, yet they are easily accessible. In the town where I live you would be hard-pressed to find two spaced further apart than a ten-minute walk and I don’t even live in the capital.

Just to set the record straight, the Fuze uses a Lithium-Polymer battery, not  a Lithium-Ion.

I stand corrected.

***

Next issue (very long section so I didn’t copy/paste) regarding capacity.

I store all my mp3s on my hard drives and on DVDs so I don’t need to keep them in my mp3 player, and yes, I’d like to keep my FUZE for as long as it’s in working order. 

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As for buying rechargeable AA batteries, actually most people do buy them. I disagree. If that were the case, we’d be seeing that damm rabbit with the drum with an AC outlet in his back on the TV commercials. No, it’s just too ‘convenient’ and cheaper (short, not long term) to pick up a package of the disposables.

Maybe this is culture specific. Also, the AA player would probably appeal to more economy-minded people who would go for the rechargeables (and then again maybe not). Anyway, I’m all for choice.

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Proprietary is the way of the world now

Fine, let them make a little slide-off panel at the back of the player and make their batteries as widely available as those of leading mobile manufacturers (there’s a mobile shop on every corner, where I live) and I’ll stop complaining - I promise.

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I think that people who don’t live in the ‘developed world’ have a lot more things to worry about than where they’re going to find a replacement battery for their mp3 player. Most likely have never even heard of such a device. Any place that is ‘developed’ enough to where NiMH batteries are readily available will also have access to Li-Ion or Li-Poly ones if they’re needed.

Depends on your definition of ‘developed’. I personally live in Serbia, which, while it is no Somalia, is far less developed than Western Europe, the US, Japan, etc and while you can definitely buy generic Li-Ion and Li-Poly batteries, as well as those produced by leading cell-phone producers, you’d have a truly hard time finding a Sandisk Sansa battery. Also, it’s nigh-on impossible to get technical goods mailed to my country since even if I find an e-tailer that ships to Serbia, the goods are almost certain to be stolen either by customs or mail officials and there isn’t a damned thing I can do about it.

***

And how many times have you found yourself more than 12 - 15 continuous hours away from a computer or AC outlet to re-charge?

Each time I go on holiday to Montenegro, although admittedly this does not happen very often.

Cheers

1 Like

@jk98 wrote:

it is easy enough to carry some spare batteries. With a player with a built in battery, if I deplete the power in the battery, I might be without use of the player for part of a day, but if I then forget to charge it when I get home, I might be without use of the player the next day as well.

But I doubt you’re ever very far away from an AC outlet to plug in a charger? Sometimes yes, fishing, hiking, etc. in the boonies, but even then you can carry a USB charging device powered by . . . yep, your AA batteries. (Oh sh!t, I think I just made a point for you) :stuck_out_tongue:

@jk98 wrote:

If there is indeed a 4000 song limit on the Fuze with the current firmware it is because they felt that few would exceed this with 16 gigs of storage. If a full sized SD slot was included instead, the limit would have been set higher.

I don’t buy this as an oversight on SanDisk’s part. A firmware boo-boo? Definitely! But with the amount of time spent in R & D and testing before these things actually make it to market, somebody would have HAD to try & put more than 4000 songs on a player. And it’s not exactly 4000. It varies; it’s just around that number. So it probably has something to do with the processor and the amount of data it can read or something. If I knew what it was, I’d fix it! But first, I’d enter into a techinal independent contractor status with SanDisk and get paid for it! :wink:

Besides, they (SanDisk) knew going into this realm that with the SDHC micro-card the possible near-future total memory capacity would be 40GB (8GB on-board & 32GB SDHC card). And the Fuze is choking on less than half that? So the idea that they would have planned for a higher ceiling with the full-size card is just silly. They should have planned (key word: planned) for it regardless!

Anyway, good back & forth! :smiley:

“But I doubt you’re ever very far away from an AC outlet to plug in a charger?”

it is not about being far from an outlet for a long time, but remembering to recharge a player with a built in battery when it needs it, and leaving enough time to do so. Some chargers will charge up to 4 AA batteries in just 15 minutes.

“but even then you can carry a USB charging device powered by . . . yep, your AA batteries.”

That seems very annoying. One would need 4 AA batteries to reach around 5 volts. If one could power the player from an external battery pack it wouldn’t be so bad, but charging the internal battery from an external battery pack does not seem like a desirable thing to do.

“I don’t buy this as an oversight on SanDisk’s part. A firmware boo-boo? Definitely!”

Not really, as a 4000 or so song limit seems reasonable when the player can’t hold more than 16 gigs, since most people use a bitrate of at least 128 kbps for their music. Having a 4000 or so song limit when 16 gig micro SD cards are available though, and the player could have 24 gigs of storage is not a good thing.

"Besides, they (SanDisk) knew going into this realm that with the SDHC micro-card the possible near-future total memory capacity would be 40GB (8GB on-board & 32GB SDHC card). "

They also knew they would have firmware updates before then.

“They should have planned (key word: planned) for it regardless!”

They did plan for it, they planned future firmware updates.  Since they are a leading maker of micro SD cards, they know exactly when certain capacity cards will be available.

Hey There JK98,

I agree. AA or AAA. I would like to see SanDisk put out a “flashless” drive player.

Modify the ImageMate Reader with an FM radio, and the firmware be able to play multiple video and audio formats (including OGG for those that want it) (less M4A/AAC of course), and view photos. Definitely increase the screen size so video is more viewable, 2.5? When you connect to a PC, I am thinking the double drive issues go away? Someone more tech savy can advise on that thought.  

To me it seems like 2GB, 4GB, 8GB flash drive players are like a game. Fill them up with high quality mp3’s, video’s, and photo’s and start buying cards for the expansion slot. 

I purchased a 4GB micro SDHC Card from the SanDisk Store for my 8GB Fuze and it is packaged with the SanDisk Adapter, so the little Micro can play in a full sized SD/MMC slot. SanDisk sells so many different size cards at so many prices I do not know why they (sales/marketing) wouldn’t find something like this a “home run”.

I’m no programmer, copy right lawyer etc. and do not know what it would take to accomplish this. Perhaps there are restrictions which would make this prohibitive. As a consumer who prefers SanDisk products over the others, this is something I would like to see. Maybe there are others, maybe not.

I just purchased an E130 from Amazon for just this purpose. (should arrive this week). Although it is a discontinued model, it plays on 1 X AAA battery, has an FM Radio, with an “up to” 2GB full size expansion slot. (You Go SanDisk!) No video capability, but I think they WERE headed in the right direction.

This is my personal wish list, so let the bashing begin! :stuck_out_tongue:

Regards

I forgot - yes on the AM for talk shows

Message Edited by mstubie on 10-05-2008 11:14 AM

@jk98 wrote:

“But I doubt you’re ever very far away from an AC outlet to plug in a charger?”

 

it is not about being far from an outlet for a long time, but remembering to recharge a player with a built in battery when it needs it, and leaving enough time to do so. Some chargers will charge up to 4 AA batteries in just 15 minutes. So by your reasoning, manufacturers should design & build an mp3 player for those few who can’t remember to charge their units? Has the cell-phone industry, who sells many, many more units than the DAP industry done this? No. They and other 3rd-party vendors sell chargers, car-chargers and even protable chargers powered by AA batteries. Same with the mp3 market. What the manufacturer does not offer, opens the door for 3rd-party accessory companies; a symbiotic relationship and one that encourages free enterprise, innovation and advancement in technology.

 

“but even then you can carry a USB charging device powered by . . . yep, your AA batteries.”

 

That seems very annoying. One would need 4 AA batteries to reach around 5 volts. If one could power the player from an external battery pack it wouldn’t be so bad, but charging the internal battery from an external battery pack does not seem like a desirable thing to do. I don’t see the difference. You would be carrying 2 devices either way. And as in the point I was making above, it’s a benefit to those who happen to forget to charge their devices and get caught short. It’s not meant as an everyday, totally reliant method.

 

“I don’t buy this as an oversight on SanDisk’s part. A firmware boo-boo? Definitely!”

 

Not really, as a 4000 or so song limit seems reasonable when the player can’t hold more than 16 gigs, since most people use a bitrate of at least 128 kbps for their music. Why is this reasonable? NOT having a limit seems reasonable. A limit is so . . . well, limiting. :stuck_out_tongue: Having a 4000 or so song limit when 16 gig micro SD cards are available though, and the player could have 24 gigs of storage is not a good thing. Maybe you haven’t heard; the 16GB SDHC card is available NOW! Yet SanDisk said they did not have time to fix this in the latest firmware release for the Fuze on Friday. Users will have to wait until the next one. And what about the e200 series users? They’re in the same “4000 song limit” boat, but no firmware update has even been hinted at for this model.

 

"Besides, they (SanDisk) knew going into this realm that with the SDHC micro-card the possible near-future total memory capacity would be 40GB (8GB on-board & 32GB SDHC card). "

 

They also knew they would have firmware updates before then. Did they really? (see above)

 

 

“They should have planned (key word: planned) for it regardless!”

 

They did plan for it, they planned future firmware updates. Not very well, it seems! Since they are a leading maker of micro SD cards, they know exactly when certain capacity cards will be available. Exactly my point! But as in other large companies, many times “one hand doesn’t know what the other is doing”. How long are the users that are buying the 16 gig cards as we speak going to have to wait for the firmware update that will “fix” this issue that shouldn’t have been as issue in the first place?

 

@mstubie wrote:

Hey There JK98,

 

I agree. AA or AAA.

SanDisk does indeed already make a AAA battery-powered mp3 player AND it has a full-size SD card slot. Just what you guys (edit: JK98 & vidra) have been asking for. It’s called the SANSA SHAKER. It even comes in colors; blue for boys & pink for girls. :stuck_out_tongue:

Also, the Sansa M series uses a AAA user-replaceable battery too. No card slot though.

Message Edited by Tapeworm on 10-05-2008 04:25 PM

Hi Tapeworm,

No, I went with E130. I’m too old to Shake! :smileyvery-happy:

Later

"Has the cell-phone industry, who sells many, many more units than the DAP industry done this? "

Cell phones have a user replaceable battery, and spares are available. When was the last time you saw a cellphone that has a battery that is not user replaceable(besides the iphone)? When was the last time you saw a digital camera with a battery that is not user replaceable?

Message Edited by JK98 on 12-11-2009 03:39 PM

@jk98 wrote:

"Has the cell-phone industry, who sells many, many more units than the DAP industry done this? "

 

Cell phones have a user replaceable battery, and spares are available. When was the last time you saw a cellphone that has a battery that is not user replaceable? When was the last time you saw a digital camera with a battery that is not user replaceable?

And so do 4 of my Sansas (e200 series).

"And so do 4 of my Sansas (e200 series). "

Imo it seems like the E200 series might be discontinued soon, since the Fuze and the Clip seem to replace it. It also seems like it is not so easy to buy spare batteries for the E200 series at a low price. The E200 seems like it only supports up to 2 gig micro SD cards.

O’contrere, Pierre. While the e200 series’ thunder is being replaced by the latest & greatest Fuze & Clip, I don’t think it will be going anywhere for a while yet. As far as the batteries go, they are plentiful and in-expensive on Amazon and E-Bay, among other places. About $9 - $15 average.

And only the v1 e200 series only support up to 2GB cards natively. But you can install Rockbox on them & get the higher SDHC support (plus a lot of other features that even the Fuze doesn’t offer). The v2's have the same processor as the Fuze & Clip and therefore _ DO _ support the SDHC cards as-is. I have an e280 (8GB) and a 8GB SDHC card. The card is filling up fast, so probably as soon as the price comes down a little on the 16 gig cards that just came out, I’ll be picking one of those up and the 8 gig card will maybe go into one of my v1’s if I install Rockbox. At that point, I’ll have 24GB capacity and a vested interest and personal concern over this 4000 song (approx.) ceiling and will be anxiously awaiting a firmware fix.

One of the problems with the Consumer Tech markets is the “me too” syndrome. I LOVED my AA Battery Samsung MT6[a-z]. I LOVE my current AAA Battery IRiver T60. My daughters and I LOVED our AAA E players. But…

When I go searching, all I see is these @#$@^& internal battery players.  If I was Rayovac, Duracell, or Everready, I’d commit to cajoling the various digital music player manufacturers to use “modular power systems”, that is, commodity, rechargeable, replaceable batteries.

Sansa should commit to ALWAYS have a micro SD slot on their players. If they made a player that:

  1. Allowed music selection by directory structure.

  2. Had a micro SD Slot.

  3. Used a AA battery.

I’d buy it immediately.

Did you see the press release on the Sandisk Slotmusic player? It is just $20, has a micro SD card slot, runs on one AAA battery, but it has no display! Sound quality is said to be worse than the Clip. I wish Sandisk would make a premium edition of this with a display, and sound quality equal to the Clip. It would be great if the player also has a clip.

Well, just to show there is a demand, I found this forum by searching for an mp3

player with a micro SD slot and an AA battery. Also a necessity on my list is mid

track resume. That probably needs a note added. I use the player for some talks

I really enjoy that are 30 to 90 minutes long.  My 2 gb Sansa will display their

length as 10 to about 19 min long. It will play the whole talk, but if a knife fight

breaks out in the seat behind me on a bus and I want to pause the talk after the

displayed time length, I can’t get back to the same spot after I’ve hid under the

seat. I have to start at the beginning again. (Darn it.)

  

Also on my wish list is AM radio (assuming fm of course) and I would really like 2

AA batteries. The sleek and sexy stuff does absolutely nothing for me. If the

player would go back to the point the battery died with its mid track resume that

would talk me out of the 2nd battery on the wish list.

I did find an audiobook page that had 11 players listed with mid track resume.

None of them were the Mac players or Zunes, and 2 that I looked at closely were

Sansas. 

I have actually brought up this question in the off topic part of 2 non related

forums and got 0 replies, so glad to find this page.

That was a lot of typing. I’m going to run back into the office, slam the door and

pour a double brandy. 

Well, this has certainly been a lively discussion!

Does anyone remember the scene from the movie “Armageddon”, where Col. Lev Andropov freaks out and grabs the pipe from Jennifer Watts, and starts to beat the hell out of the spaceship?

Do you remember his lines? Lev: “It’s stuck, yes?” Watts: “Back off! You don’t know the components!” Lev: [annoyed] “Components. American components, Russian components, ALL MADE IN TAIWAN!”

Are there any Chinese interpreters in the house?

Message Edited by mstubie on 11-05-2008 10:28 PM

Message Edited by mstubie on 11-05-2008 10:45 PM

the EU has made some useful rullings, in reaction to apple not having user servicable batteries I suspect. Namely that all new kit must have user servicable batteries either via simple cover or with the use of upto two screws

 I suspect that AAA based MP3 players will be coming soon after.

Interesting to see various discussions on this AA/AAA powered player. 

I am a very (very) big fan of a AA powered small mp3 player.  I mean AA and not AAA.  I have the sansa m260 and like it a lot - my biggest wish for it is it should used a AA and not a AAA.  Come on who would mind a slight extra bulkiness (if that was the reason) if they were offered 3x the battery life?  This would have been my PERFECT player if it had used AA and not AAA.  Of course I am also a big fan of being able to turn the backlight off (in daytime) or setting it to 1 second.  It gives me a feeling that I am not unnecessarily wasting precious battery juice (it is possible that the display drain is a very small percentage, but still…), along these lines I really wish the sansa player did not have the bright circular blue ring light in almost all their players nowadays…

Though I am not a regular listener, I simply like the idea of popping in a battery anytime I wish and enjoy for hours and not having to think about the charge on the player…

Actually I just baught aaa batteries from ebay that were 1500 mah so 1000 is not the highest.

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&ssPageName=STRK:MEWNX:IT&item=370124006483 

Have you tested those 1500 mah nimh AAA batteries? I find it hard to believe that they would provide 50% more run time than the Sanyo 1000 mah AAA nimh batteries.

I just noticed the 18650 lithium ion rechargeable battery. It is only around $5 retail,  and a charger that charges two of them is only around $10 retail. It holds more than double the power of a 2900 mah AA nimh battery, but is only slightly larger. It would be cool if Sandisk designed a player with an easily replaceable battery using the 18650, and packaged the player with a charger and two 18650 batteries.

Message Edited by JK98 on 12-21-2008 01:52 AM