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SanDisk Guru
Posts: 1,265
Registered: ‎04-24-2009

Re: Pitch bug on Clip+?

[ Edited ]

I think using ABX for differences in pitch is somewhat misleading.  With a reference distinguishing tiny differences in frequency is actually pretty easy.  Thats why people use pitch forks when tuning instruments and certainly manage to tune much better then 1%.  But being able to do it with a pitch fork, digital tuner, etc doesn't mean you can tune it by ear . . .

 

What really matters is if you can notice a difference during actual music without a reference tone which is much harder to do since its equivalent to tuning by ear.  I certainly can't do that.  

 

Edit:  Not that you shouldn't ABX, I just mean the results are difficult to compare to normal listening in this particular case because the reference actually changes your perception.   

Message Edited by saratoga on 10-31-2009 01:56 PM
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SanDisk Professor
Posts: 579
Registered: ‎12-02-2008

Re: Pitch bug on Clip+?

That's pretty funny considering that a lot of people who will announce that the effects of switching to oxygen-free cable, magic green markers for the edges of CD's, "breaking in" cables, etc are obvious will start hemming and hawing when asked about ABX or double blind testing and come up with reasons why it's invalid from that end.  Either that it doesn't work, or is not worth the trouble when the difference is so clear without it!

 

I agree in that IMO ABX testing is more sensitive to differences than I care to worry about for most things, but I was responding specifically to a post that most people probably couldn't ABX the difference in pitch.

 

BTW, I did run it again, listening to the A (1000 Hz) and B (1003 Hz) and X samples only in the first trial and listening  to ONLY the X sample after that and still ended up with 8/11 right.. with practice I think I could do better.

 

Tuning with a tuning fork is easier as you are hearing both tones at once and can key on the beat frequency to tell if they're the same.   

 

 

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SanDisk Guru
Posts: 3,233
Registered: ‎09-13-2008

Re: Pitch bug on Clip+?

" agree in that IMO ABX testing is more sensitive to differences than I care to worry about for most things, but I was responding specifically to a post that most people probably couldn't ABX the difference in pitch. BTW, I did run it again, listening to the A (1000 Hz) and B (1003 Hz) and X samples only in the first trial and listening to ONLY the X sample after that and still ended up with 8/11 right.. with practice I think I could do better."

 

 

I was referring to ABX testing using a few different music tracks, not test tones. While some small percentage of people might be able to hear a 0.25% difference in pitch, the vast majority of people won't be able to hear it.

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SanDisk Guru
Posts: 5,822
Registered: ‎12-26-2007

Re: Pitch bug on Clip+?

To my ears, the pitch variation of the original Clip was never a major issue, a fair trade for running the processor in its lowest power consumption mode.  The Clip gets a crazy amount of play time out of that wee LiPo battery.

 

I would like to see the timing issue resolved for the original device, as it has been effectively done for the new Clip+.  Time will tell on that issue (pardon the shameless pun).  The Clip+ does consume those electrons a bit more than its elder sister, but I do like the improved functionalities of the new toy.

 

Hey, the podcast order is oldest-to-newest as well, a welcome improvement.

 

Currently, I'm trying to kill my Clip+, down to 50% on the battery .  I've been working quite a few trials on it these past weeks, with various codecs, so it's been plugged in for a large percentage of its time.

 

Bob  Smiley Very Happy

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SanDisk User
Posts: 29
Registered: ‎10-10-2009

Re: Pitch bug on Clip+?

[ Edited ]

There is one thing I am very curious about: 
I never heard that any other manufacturer had this particular problem with their players (correct me if I am wrong). 

It would be really interesting to know what are the real technical reasons (in the first place) that such a problem creeps in such a long time and why is Sandisk so secretive about it.
I mean why they just don't release concrete numbers to support the claims that using correct clock frequencies would have such a major influence on battery life. And if so, what kind of brain-damaged SOC is that (presumably the core is AMS AS3525).
http://www.austriamicrosystems.com/eng/content/download/16763/295720/file/AS3525_Datasheet_v1_13.pdf

I can' t really enjoy my Fugue (which consist of a single constant 1kHz Tone) but I must admit that thanks to Sandisk it got more interesting Smiley Happy

 


Message Edited by m9zf3n5w on 11-06-2009 03:07 PM
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SanDisk Guru
Posts: 1,265
Registered: ‎04-24-2009

Re: Pitch bug on Clip+?


@m9zf3n5w wrote:

 

It would be really interesting to know what are the real technical reasons (in the first place) that such a problem creeps in such a long time and why is Sandisk so secretive about it.


 

 
They started with a PLL clock that couldn't do 44.1kHz and didn't want to change it once they realized their mistake because its a lot of work.  Not sure what you mean by secretive.  
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SanDisk User
Posts: 29
Registered: ‎10-10-2009

Re: Pitch bug on Clip+?

[ Edited ]

That what you just said is similar to that I suspected as well (and already posted here before). 
Where did you get that information from ?
The only official Sandisk statement I know of is something like, it had to be that way, otherwise your player will quickly run out of battery and then explode Smiley Happy , no mistake on our side Smiley Happy That's what I meant by "secretive".

Message Edited by m9zf3n5w on 11-06-2009 03:26 PM
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Newbie
Posts: 4
Registered: ‎08-31-2009

Re: Pitch bug on Clip+?

Ok, I originally started this thread.

 

I finally bought a 4GB Clip+ on Friday.

 

If there's a pitch problem with it, I cannot hear it, unlike with the Clip v2. That's all that matters to me.

 

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SanDisk Guru
Posts: 8,152
Registered: ‎12-11-2007

Re: Pitch bug on Clip+?

Talk about full circle!

 

Smiley Happy

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SanDisk Guru
Posts: 4,898
Registered: ‎11-17-2008

Re: Pitch bug on Clip+?


@Miikerman wrote:

Talk about full circle!

 

Smiley Happy


How is it full circle? He started the thread asking if the pitch issue was present in the Clip+, and now that he has one, he can't hear any pitch variance. Smiley Wink

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