getting song ratings on the PC from clip

If you’ve read the thread, you’d realize I don’t really mean syncing and storing song ratings - only the ability to just view them outside of the clip.  It is a bug because it is implemented, just not working.  I don’t understand why they even put the ability to assign songs a rating in the clip if there was not a purpose to it other than looking at what you just assigned ratings to. 

This lack of support from the community and sandisk for firmware issues is what turned me off of porting rockbox to the clip.  This is such an easy fix and easy to test, and I’ve hardly got any confirmations of the bug or support.

Message Edited by johnnyz86 on 07-27-2009 10:36 PM

@johnnyz86 wrote:

If you’ve read the thread, you’d realize I don’t really mean syncing and storing song ratings - only the ability to just view them outside of the clip.  It is a bug because it is implemented, just not working.  I don’t understand why they even put the ability to assign songs a rating in the clip if there was not a purpose to it other than looking at what you just assigned ratings to.  

In order to view the ratings outside of the Clip, don’t they need to be copied via MTP from the Clip to the host computer?  Generally when this is done, changed ratings can move in either direction, hence the word “sync”.

So it seems that the Clip stores the ratings in its own internal database, but hasn’t implemented the portion of the MTP protocol that syncs (“copies”, if you prefer) the ratings to the PC.  I’m still not sure I consider this to be a bug, but, whatever.  I’d like to have it too, FWIW.

The purpose of being able to rate songs on the Clip appears to be only to dictate which songs go into the “Top Rated” list.

Message Edited by PromisedPlanet on 07-28-2009 08:53 AM

@promisedplanet wrote:


@johnnyz86 wrote:

If you’ve read the thread, you’d realize I don’t really mean syncing and storing song ratings - only the ability to just view them outside of the clip.  It is a bug because it is implemented, just not working.  I don’t understand why they even put the ability to assign songs a rating in the clip if there was not a purpose to it other than looking at what you just assigned ratings to.  


In order to view the ratings outside of the Clip, don’t they need to be copied via MTP from the Clip to the host computer? 

 

No, they can just be viewed in from WMP or WinAmp or even in MSC mode if they un-hid the files - the way it rates the files is not by editing the audio file, but by editing a database file.  If they just un-hid all of the files, I would be happy, because I am sure I could decode the database file.

 

Generally when this is done, changed ratings can move in either direction, hence the word “sync”.

A feature I don’t care about, but it does work - just the ratings are off.

 

So it seems that the Clip stores the ratings in its own internal database

Correct, but I don’t care about copying

 

but hasn’t implemented the portion of the MTP protocol that syncs (“copies”, if you prefer) the ratings to the PC. 

Actually, it is implemented, you can view them in WMP, and also copy the songs to the PC, and the song ratings are there - they are just off by some amount.  I’m not requesting to copy the ratings to the PC.  Sansa  claims to support WMP 10 and 11, which it does, except for how it tags ratings.   It does, just one value somewhere has a -1 or something.  

 

I’m still not sure I consider this to be a bug, but, whatever.

’Whatever’ indeed

 

I’d like to have it too, FWIW.

Yay, finally someone supports this

 

The purpose of being able to rate songs on the Clip appears to be only to dictate which songs go into the “Top Rated” list.

A worthless feature if one has to tag it every time it is transfered to the clip.  Actually, maybe getting PC ratings to the clip works, that would be even more absurd if it could read ratings just fine, just not write them fine.  If that isn’t a bug, I don’t know what is.

Message Edited by PromisedPlanet on 07-28-2009 08:53 AM

It’s frustrating that I can’t access this ratings information the way I want. I want to be able to rate songs on the Clip[, then use that information to transfer files to a favorites collection on another portable device. Ideally I want to see the Clip ratings show up in WinAmp or some usable media player. It would be nice to just open the ratings file that it stored on the clip. Is there anyway to translate that data to just get a list?

The ratings are stored in MTABLE.SYS.  If you save this file to disk, then change a song’s rating and do a binary file comparison between the file on the Clip and the one you saved, you’ll see the value change.  Unfortunately it isn’t obvious how to mathematically determine the offset of the rating (it’s not near the tag information), so I’ll leave it to someone who cares to figure this out.  :wink:

Message Edited by PromisedPlanet on 07-29-2009 07:49 AM

I have just bought a clip+ (this week!) and to find out that song rating sync is not supported is very frustrating.

I already own about 5 different size and generation of ipod, but loved the small form factor and audio capabilities of the Clip+.

I use J River’s Media Center to manage my music - I can get it to sync the songs and playlists etc to the clip+ in msc mode, but cannot then retrieve any play data or ratings data.

My wish is to load the clip+ with new albums recently bought and then rate the songs while mobile, then sync with J River Media Center on my PC - surely not that hard to do???

If not, like others, I have to ask why are Sansa still selling this device if they are not prepared to support it…

@toomanybarts wrote:

I have just bought a clip+ (this week!) and to find out that song rating sync is not supported is very frustrating.

I already own about 5 different size and generation of ipod, but loved the small form factor and audio capabilities of the Clip+.

 

I use J River’s Media Center to manage my music - I can get it to sync the songs and playlists etc to the clip+ in msc mode, but cannot then retrieve any play data or ratings data.

 

My wish is to load the clip+ with new albums recently bought and then rate the songs while mobile, then sync with J River Media Center on my PC - surely not that hard to do???

 

If not, like others, I have to ask why are Sansa still selling this device if they are not prepared to support it…

Use MTP mode if you want to do that kind of stuff.

@toomanybarts wrote:

I have just bought a clip+ (this week!) and to find out that song rating sync is not supported is very frustrating.

I already own about 5 different size and generation of ipod, but loved the small form factor and audio capabilities of the Clip+.

 

I use J River’s Media Center to manage my music - I can get it to sync the songs and playlists etc to the clip+ in msc mode, but cannot then retrieve any play data or ratings data.

 

My wish is to load the clip+ with new albums recently bought and then rate the songs while mobile, then sync with J River Media Center on my PC - surely not that hard to do???

 

If not, like others, I have to ask why are Sansa still selling this device if they are not prepared to support it…

If the Clip won’t do this, it’s not that SanDisk is not prepared to support the player–it’s just that the player may not do 1 thing you would like it to do . . . .  Such is the way with electronics and programming oftentimes, unfortunately. 

Have to disagree Miikerman sorry.

Firmware is software - Rockbox dev’s have proved that if you put some thought and effort in you can achieve al lot through software.

The fact that the clip+ has ratings and the fact that in MTP mode it stores the rating in a dBase file in some fashion tells me that it IS possible and if enough people asked for it, it could be done.

I’m just starting with a petition of 1 right now!  :)

toomanybarts, I don’t disagree with you at all, there.   :wink:

@toomanybarts wrote:

I have just bought a clip+ (this week!) and to find out that song rating sync is not supported is very frustrating.

I already own about 5 different size and generation of ipod, but loved the small form factor and audio capabilities of the Clip+.

 

I use J River’s Media Center to manage my music - I can get it to sync the songs and playlists etc to the clip+ in msc mode, but cannot then retrieve any play data or ratings data.

 

My wish is to load the clip+ with new albums recently bought and then rate the songs while mobile, then sync with J River Media Center on my PC - surely not that hard to do???

 

If not, like others, I have to ask why are Sansa still selling this device if they are not prepared to support it…

As I said before, this is what MTP mode is good for…if you want to use ratings, use MTP mode.

@marvin_martian wrote:

As I said before, this is what MTP mode is good for…if you want to use ratings, use MTP mode.

One of the few things MTP mode IS good for. :stuck_out_tongue:

Doesnt work with j river media center - what a PITA!

And before any Sansa White Knight appears and tells me its J River’s fault - if Sansa were to make the dBase more transparent in MTP mode, some 12 yr old would end up programming a J River Media Center plugin and we’d ALL be happy!

(And clearly it’s not just me that wants this - this thread has reached page 4 and Google shows many others).

Listen, I love the form factor of the clip+ and I’m amazed at the audio quality, I just want ratings and ratings sync - something iPod has been doing faultlessly for 10 years!

Absolutely agreed that it would be nice if the Clips (or a next generation player?) were brought up to date with current and even some fun/exciting features.  Fortunately for me, I have vanilla tastes and generally simply listen to music and the fm.  Although, a functional clock and alarm, and even athletic counter (pedometer?), would be nice …   :wink:

@miikerman wrote:

Absolutely agreed that it would be nice if the Clips (or a next generation player?) were brought up to date with current and even some fun/exciting features.  Fortunately for me, I have vanilla tastes and generally simply listen to music and the fm.  Although, a functional clock and alarm , and even athletic counter (pedometer?), would be nice …   :wink:

I have a cell phone for that.:wink:

Cool. Others of us don’t, or don’t want to have to bring a phone with us for that. :wink:

not sure im withyou Miikerman on the pedomteer etc.

I really just use my ipod and want to use my clip + to listen to music and to rate what I like (so that I can relisten to the good stuff!).

I work in music and so get a lot of new music constantly to listen to - life’s too short to listen to bad music…hence ratings!

It’s a shame the dev’s dont actually bother to look at these forums - unlike J river who do respond, fix and tweak based on CUSTOMER feedback…I guess they set these up to apease the masses!

I’m off to Twitter and Facebook to start a Sansa Ratings revolution!

Rvolutions can be good things!

Revolutions can be good things!

@toomanybarts wrote:

not sure im withyou Miikerman on the pedomteer etc.

I really just use my ipod and want to use my clip + to listen to music and to rate what I like (so that I can relisten to the good stuff!).

I work in music and so get a lot of new music constantly to listen to - life’s too short to listen to bad music…hence ratings!

 

It’s a shame the dev’s dont actually bother to look at these forums - unlike J river who do respond, fix and tweak based on CUSTOMER feedback…I guess they set these up to apease the masses!

 

I’m off to Twitter and Facebook to start a Sansa Ratings revolution!

Good luck. But I think you’re missing the point here, that the ratings being an issue for you is due to your allegiance to J River Media Center…they work for others with MTP mode that use other programs. So to say that Sansa isn’t listening is perhaps unfair.:dizzy_face: